its not as easy as realigning yourself from the Trib to the D News now is it !!!!!!!

What an idiotic comment from Hey Andrew. Wow.

There is an opening at the UHSAA, this state needs a man with passion to stand tall in the face of all this opposition. Change is tough, but very needed. You point out discrepancys in the proposed alignment, there are just as many discrepancys in the current setup but schools are dealing with it. Respect for the leadership is needed. Let them do their job.

It is never an easy thing when it is time for realignment. It is interesting that of all the schools and districts expressing concerns--one school (Gunnison) is represented not by their district, not by their principal, not by their athletic director, but by their football coach. He has been there at every meeting, even the first meeting that schools weren't supposed to be to. Is he trying to save his coaching job? I would think the baseball coach isn't trying to get a "watered down" 2A. Other programs at their school have been competitive. His presence at the meetings should send a big message to the committee. Is it really good for the school district to have Manti and Gunnison split up? Splitting them up results in increased out of school time and increased transportation costs. It's obvious that the thinking is all about wins and losses.

Realignment is really pretty easy.
What gets in the way is the "emotion" involved.
Disparity between enrollment figures.
Winning programs.
Losing programs.
Moving away from long time rivals.
Being moved into a Region with a team you don't like.
It's all really silly.
If there are regulations for the number of students that make up a classification. Use it.
It's much easier to work with facts than emotion.
If Olympus has to drive to Woods Cross for a game the uproar can be heard in Kansas. If South Summit has to drive to Moab for a game no one blinks an eye.
Please, just do the right thing and take the emotion out of it.

Travel is an issue during the realignment, obviously. Most of the smaller schools (1-3A) have to travel far more than 4A and 5A. However, when 4-5A schools are asked to travel to Uintah or St. George, that is asking too much of their programs. It is no more of a financial burden on larger schools to travel than it is for smaller schools. However, how many of the 4-5A schools travel out of the state for preseason games and don't even bat an eye? So, in my opinion, travel should be taken into consideration to try to keep costs down if possible, but it cannot continue to be the crutch for schools who simply would be inconvenienced by having to travel to St. George, Uintah, or other schools.

TRY BEING A HEAD COACH FOR A SOUTH UTAH VALLEY TEAM AND BEING TOLD YOU MAY BE IN A REGION WITH 3 ST GEORGE SCHOOL. YOU WILL SPEND MORE TIME ON THE ROAD THEN IN THE GYM. PLUS TRAVEL COST FOR A BUS TO GO TO ST GEORGE IS AROUND 1000. THREE TIMES FOR EACH SPORT THE DISTRICTS WILL GO BANCRUPT PAYING TRAVEL.
BUT I AGREE THE ST GEORGE SCHOOLS CAN NOT BE IN A REGION OF 3 TEAMS WITH 3 OTHER TEAMS THAT ARE 3A IT IS A LOT HARDER THEN YOU THINK

Dido!! How sad it would be to tweak the whole allignment because one program, not school, is not as competitive as another. Isn't it always like that? Someone takes first, someone takes last. That is real life.

Cowboy up UHSAA and the "concerned citizens with interest in changing the alignment to benefit themselves".

Instead of moving all of the decent 2A schools up to 3A, to allow Gunnison to win a boys basketball game, let the Gunnison boys team play in the girls 2A classification. They would definitely win some games and would compete with Richfield, South Sevier and North Sevier for the region championship.

Go back to a 1A-4A. We don't have enough teams for a 5A classification. All the state championships are watered down with small classifications.

To Not Easy, I would argue that the schools like Uintah, Delta, Grande County, San Juan, and countless others spend a lot more money on transportation than the South Valley schools you speak of. What is the difference? Someone has to travel, so why pick on the same schools all the time while the Wasatch Front schools enjoy the pampered travel schedule and extra money in the districts' pockets that other districts have to put toward travel?

To anonymous, I disagree. Although we don't have as many schools as other states, most other states don't have as much of a jump from the smaller schools to the larger. 3A in Utah goes from 400 to 1200; a team playing a school three times their size does not exactly seem reasonable.
I am curious though; what would you suggest for the cut-off numbers between the 4 classifications?

Some of these comments are right on! LET THE NUMBERS FALL WHERE THEY FALL! It is not everyone elses fault that a certain school can't compete. Sorry! Those are your numbers. There are a LOAD of teams that don't compete year in and year out, but that is life. I agree with "someone has to take first and someone has to take last". Deal with it. All these small schools travel EVERY game, so quit crying Wasatch front schools, it is time you start as well! I guess you will have to cut down on your outside of the state games! There are no complaints on traveling to Hawaii and California is there? But heavens no... to travel to St. George!! Do what is right UHSAA!

YOU GO HUCK!!!

Most Coaches like myself will play anyone, anywhere!
I prefere playing bigger schools as I feel this helps us when we play our region games.

.........no matter what class they are in. That is just the way it is, get use to it.

I think expecting the Utah County schools to drive 4 hours to St. George to play a baseball game or soccer game is totally ridiculous... (as well as for the St. George teams to drive that far north to play a game)..

It costs money and is dangerous for the athletes and parents.

Let them remain in their own region..

Just put everyone in the classifications based on their enrollment PERIOD. No exceptions. As for the traveling whiners I competed in Montana and every game was at least a two hour bus ride. It is not that big of a deal.

I'm back with my two cents. I agree with Huck, because back in my high school days we had a teacher come down to Monticello from Pleasant Grove and said his kids were amazed in the travel time differences. Instead of leaving at 4 in the afternoon to get to a football game we left at 8 or sometimes 6 in the morning just to get where we were going. Also with the person that said if the bigger schools can come up with the money to play out of state then they shouldn't whine about having to travel instate. There are no easy answers but the emotion needs not be an issue with this. Look at all the schools in each classification. Put them in the classification where the numbers are similar. Not the same, but similar. Yes there will be some schools with a lot of students playing schools with not so many but thats just life. I'm not saying 1A should play 4A unless they want to but keep the classifications competitive but fair as well. Good luck to the folks at the UHSAA in coming up with a good plan.

To the person that said that driving 4 hours to play a soccer game (or other sports) is ridiculous. I agree with you on that. Simple solution, that other states use. Example...Say Payson is in the St. George region. They schedule Pine View on Friday and then Dixie on Saturday. Stay overnight. You kill two games with one stone. If teams have to travel like that, you simply play two schools while you are there in the area. Good luck UHSAA, once again do the right thing.

To anonymous:
I am proud to say I went to Delta High School. While I was there, our region consisted of the following: North Sanpete, an hour and a half; Richfield, and hour and a half; Carbon, three hours; Emery, three hours. For soccer, since it was relatively new and not many schools had soccer, we were in the St. George region one year. Cedar City is more than two hours away, and St. George is around three and a half hours away.
I currently live in Vernal where Uintah's closest opponent in region other than Union is over two hours away.
So, my question is: why is it any safer or more acceptable for these schools to travel these distances year in and year out, but the Wasatch Front schools can't afford it and can't deal with the travel time?
It is time for the double standard to eliminated.

Gunnison should move to 1A, so should North Sevier since their football team plays in the 1A division and let the other 2A schools remain.

Compromise is the answer. Instead of traveling all the was to St. George, play all of your games in Beaver. Pick up some cheese curds after the game. That will shorten the trip back to Utah County.

Hey, let's throw Highland into the same region as the St. George schools!
This will give me a great excuse to spend my weekends in St. George, soaking up the sunshine!

4A and 5A are such babies. Uhsaa needs to quit pampering them so much. 3A-1A travel all over the state to play games, it is not a big deal for a 4A or 5A school to travel occasionaly. I am sick of watching them get pampered by everybody, like they are all that matters. UHSAA needs to step up and do the right thing for everybody not just worry about the bigger schools.

Our school travels 2-4 hours all the time for our games. You get use to it. Its about time the bigger schools do it. Lets see how big you really are. Put the school numbers where they are and let the kids play.

Put Gunnison in a special league. Don't keep score at any of their games. Give them a trophy and a treat at the end of the season.

Travel time should not be the issue here. My kids have to travel 2-4 hours all the time for their games and nobody blinks an eye. Its about time 4a and 5a schools do a little travel as well. Unsafe... well its unsafe for anyone to be on the road so what are you going to do...quit driving all together. Just put the numbers where they are. If the schools have to travel so be it. Get over it!!!!

4a and 5a schools are different from the rural 1-3a..

why do they have to go out of their way to accommodate them?

Doesn't make any sense at all.. You choose to live in a rural area.. we don't.

Last week, Logan made a proposal that seems more equitable. The big problem I have with the original proposal is having around 25 5A schools and 21 3A schools, but having around 35 schools in the 4A.

Be fair to more athletes!! This proposal would mean 3A would have 16 schools [team sports] qualify for state, which leaves about five schools staying home. 5A is similar.

In 4A, 16 schools [teams] qualify for state, but 19 stay home. There's a big difference with only five missing out on the state experience than 19!!

Whatever the final decision is, the different classifications from 2A to 5A need to be closer to the same number of teams in each classification. That way, it is more fair for more athletes to have a shot at experiencing state competition.

[Although 1A may have 30-38 schools, many of those schools don't have all the different sports that the larger schools have; some schools have few to no sporting teams. Therefore, they could remain larger in number.]

Good luck and I hope those people making the final decisions consider all the athletes first, not their own school or community; think about the whole state!

I don't understand what you mean? How are you accomodating the rural nusiances? You make it sound like rural communities are nothing but second class citizens!
St. George isn't a rural area any more, so maybe you urbanites ought to accomodate them!

Ok Anonymous... It is not about who is better because they live in rural or nonrural areas. And no, you are no different from those in the "Rural" areas. Most kids are exactly the same and most schools consist of the same kids and same problems. What does living in a RURAL area have to do with traveling to St. George? St. George is a NON rural area anyway. When my students register for school there is no box that says: Because you live in a rural area you will have to travel more and be treated less than those that do not live in a rural area... Someone please help this guy see the light!

And To the AD/Coach
I am currently a coach, and I agree with be fair to the athletes... But seriously BE FAIR... It is about numbers and if there are more schools that fit into the 4A category then sorry but that is the way it goes. You know 3A has been stepped on for the past several years and it is high time someone makes this all more equal. Go by numbers, that is the only fair way to do it.

4A and 5A always get what they want, they are special!! What a joke. I do have one question though...Why was 5A boys basketball so special to have 3 referees in their state tourney games?? But everyone else gets 2 refs??? Once again, what a joke! Make this realignment fair for all, you already give the upper classifications everything they need!

I too went to Delta High School and I have to say that as a student I don't know why anyone complains about having to travel! You are not in class and you are not getting marked a sluff for it! Some of my greatest memories are from the bus trips we took and the time spent on the bus! I remember sitting in the back with my friends causing all sorts of crazy commotion and laughing the entire time. It is part of the experience! I think that those people that don't get the opportunity to travel are missing out! Oh ya and the other good thing: Extra Hours of Sleep!!!

re:Anonymous 1:32 and Anonymous 6:50.
Those are some big comments. Wow 4 hours on 1-15. Try driving from Green River to Navajo Mountain. Grand or San Juan to South Sevier. Escalante to Milford,
How many overnight trips does your school make? I struggle hearing about travel costs from schools that would play half or more of their schedule with in an hour of their homes. The closest region game my teams play in is over an hour away.
Yeah I choose to live in a rural area, but you choose to live in an urban area. Using where one has decided to live is a FOOLISH argument.
Those of you that say it isn't fair to make 4A schools travel are saying that they are more important than the smaller classifications.
Oh yeah tell your team to quit traveling to Hawaii, Arizona or where ever else. Also instead of those costly plush charter buses, try taking a school bus. Now I know not all big schools travel to out of state tourneys or use charter buses, but enough of them do to make travel a non argument.

Leave the St. George teams in a 3 team region, but let all 3 teams qualify for the state tournament in all sports and take one spot in the tournament away from the Utah County region. Maybe then the Utah county teams would shut up. The St. George teams are forced to schedule 2-3 games each against Las Vegas schools because they can't get many games from teams up north. Then when the St. George schools beat the northern schools in state they act like it was the biggest upset. It would be wise for the teams from the north to learn who their competition is and be better prepared.

Imagine that-- Logan coming up with a plan to keep them in 3A.

wow I'm so glad manti is going to stay 2a, we won't have to play huge 3a schools like delta, and n. sanpete they have so many more kids we just can't compete.

One possible solution for the St. George schools is for the Washington County school district to realign their boundaries and equalize the enrollments in the five area high schools (Pine View, Snow Canyon, Dixie, Hurricane, and Desert Hills). This would give them all about 1000 students and allow them to compete together in the same region. This would essentially solve their problems from a travel standpoint and help preserve local rivalries. Another idea is to maintain the 3a upper limit at 1200 so that Cedar and Canyon View could stay in the same region with them as well.

Regarding travel to St. George, I would argue that it isn't that big of a deal. For instance, if Provo, Springville, and Payson were put into a region with Dixie, Pine View and Snow Canyon, 2 games for each school would be within 20 minutes, and 3 would be about 4 hours. This would be the same for every school in that region. Adding all of those together, you get 26 hours +/- of travel time. That is not taking into consideration a weekend trip where multiple games are played. Now, look at Delta. Using the same theory in their region, they travel about 20 hours per team, and that is only a five team region. Or Uintah, who travels 25 hours.
To me, that is an intriguing comparison. And to be honest, it doesn't stack up to most 1-2A travel schedules.

I like your idea Coach, but I think that would be a short term solution. St. George is growing fast enough that they will all be over the limit in just a few years again. Maybe that is the way to go for the next few years, if those would be the actual numbers.

Back in the late 70's when Dixie was the only HS in town, we traveled all the time. Our region consisted of Springville, Spanish, Provo, Lehi etc... traveling was not a big deal back then, and it shouldn't be now either. Re-align a new region now and lets start beating up on each other again.

You can do anything with numbers. All you need to do is raise the 3A limit and/or lower the 5A numbers to balance the classifications. That way, less schools would 'fit' into the 4A and it would balance classifications out! That is being FAIR. Sorry you don't understand that is just what they did to make the new realignment. They moved numbers, but bunched too many into 4A. It is simple.

Here, here! to "Back in the Day"! My father graduated from Payson back in the early '70's. He traveled to Uintah for region play. Travel is easier now than it was then.

Since realignment happens (supposedly) every 4 years, I would support Washington County re-aligning its boundaries to fit all 5 schools in the 3A numbers--it is nothing new for them to re-align boundaries. They are quite good at it, just check with the folks in Leeds. Then, when you add in Cedar High and Canyon View High they could all play in a 7 team region. That makes a TRUCKLOAD more sense than the silly 3 team 4a, 3 team 3a region we have going on.

OH, and WHILE THEY ARE adjusting boundaries, the football playing student-athletes and parents at SCHS would be much obliged if the district would please draw a squiggly line that goes around their houses and somehow magically places them in the boundaries for Pine View, Dixie, or Desert Hills High----so they DO NOT have to spend another nightmare season with the ding dong head the administration at SCHS insists on calling their new head coach...Signed, Frustrated and Discouraged

the big deal about travel distance now is not only taking away class time but GAS PRICES.

To whoever replied to me: Sorry that you don't understand what I was getting at. I was pretty much pointing out that the NEW alignment of RAISING the numbers in 2A and Lowering the numbers in 3A is the only fair way to do it... But you are right, you can fix the 4A 5A problems with some number adjusting. Once you get as big as 4A the numbers are not as big of a deal as they are in 1-3A.... So I totally agree with you I just didn't say anything about 4A vs 5A numbers... But I still think that guy with Rural vs Non Rural comments is a joke.

Go with the first reallignment that the UHSAA came up with. It is equitable and fair for the students and schools. Huck, Finn and chip have it right. If there are a bunch of 4A schools, so what?

So what? That's a poor response. If there were 32-36 3A teams trying to qualify teams and individuals for state competition, you would surely complain. Think of All-State teams and Academic All-State teams being selected. Taking the top ten academic kids from 35 schools in one classification and ten from only 19-21 schools eliminates consideration for a lot of deserving athletes in the larger classification, regardless if the larger was 3A or 4A. It just seems more fair to balance the number of teams in each classification, as mentioned in an earlier statement.

Please understand this is for all the athletes, not your son or daughter in 3A only. If an athlete earns recognition in an equally represented classification, it would mean more.

In response to "Response to 3A parent", I would have to agree to a point. Although it isn't fair to have vastly more schools in one classification than another, it also isn't fair for schools to compete against competition with vastly more athletes to choose from, and for the same reasons. Every athlete should have the same opportunity for success as the next, and either scenario mentioned here would compromise the integrity of that opportunity in some way. I think the root of the problem lies in growing school size. While the smaller schools are staying relatively the same size, the larger schools keep getting larger and larger. The numbers of the bigs and those of the smalls are polarizing, not growing equally. This is cause of having so many more schools fitting into the 4A division. In the same way you can't ask a student to compete against stacked odds for all-state nominations and tournament competition for state titles due to an increase in schools in that classification, you also can't ask the same student to compete against stacked odds due to the number of students represented by an extremely larger school.