I agree with Rev Davis, Obama just can't jettison his pastor, In fact it shows something of the integrity and strength of charater Obama has that he has't disclaimed asscoiation with the Reverend to increase his stature on the the campaign trail.

You would think that people in Utah of all people would be empathetic to the grilling Barack Obama has taken over this matter.

You would think that as many times as their religious beliefs have been misquoted, taken out of context and generally demonized, they would feel some empathy for those who have to endure the same fate.

Perhaps with such feelings of empathy you would think they would chose to do the right thing and rush to defend the Reverend Wright and Barack Obama.

Under no circumstance would anyone expect them to agree with what the Reverend Wright said, but you would think the good people of the Beehive State would be on the forefront defending a man's right to worship God according to the guidelines dictated by his own conscience.

Perhaps another day.

I respectfully submit that if Rev. Wright's comments were in the tradition of the black church, then the black clergy should reconsider their approach to ministering to their flock.

The Reverent Davis has been an outstanding leader and speaker of truth in this community for decades. What concerns me is that only 40 people showed up to listen to him in St. George.

I went to school at Dixie in the 70's. The influx of white-flight from California to Southern Utah has not enhanced the community; only damaged it.

Please, go home, we don't need you or want your hate and vitriol.

has always been harmful, if not destructive, to both. The African-American community has been poorly served by selling its soul to the Democratic Party and its initiative-draining dependence-fostering philosophy. To the extent that political activist who promote and benefit from that relationship (even if the community in general does not benefit from it) are also religious leaders an important potential check/balance is lost.

Many news reports since Rev Wright surfaced have depicted him and his positions as not that unusual. One wonders if the situation is serving its community well.

Accurate appraisal. I cannot deny the relationships I had with ministers I listened to in Utah county. One gave very long sermons and prayers. Very long sermons. Wow. Not too comforting, though. One gave shorter sermons and shorter prayers and was more youth oriented. Kids liked him. One was incredibly good in the pulpit and outside of it as well. Older guy but had been a preacher on horseback at one time in West Virginia and he could relate so easily to everyone. Parishioners, as in all Christian churches, listen and think. They may or may not be moved to action.

I am glad that Obama had a preacher who laid it out there for Obama to accept, reject, or ponder. Very normal actually for some Christian congregations. I know from experience.

Yes I agree, words are important, they are our primary method of communication and if pre-schoolers, no matter what their ethnicity can be encouraged to read, to use language correctly and to seek knowledge, that is such a good thing. I don't agree that there is no need for a seperation between church and state, but neither do I applaud a severance. In the case of African-Americans there can be no right thinking person that does not acknowledge that there has been an historic deprivation of that part of the community, a deprivation of both education and opportunity. If the churches, whether Baptist, LDS, or whatever can help and aid their members to gain education and thereby to improve their ability to participate in and to influence for the good the society in which they live, so much the better. It is not just ethnic minorities that are disadvantaged, there are many poor, ill educated caucasians too. Religion needs to be an active force and not just encourage passive participation in whatever life throws at you. If the Baptists can improve society for African Americans it will ultimately benefit us all, good for them!

One of the reasons why Wrights words have been damaging to Obama in my mind is that Obama has sold himself as a "uniter." Yet it does not appear that he did anything in his church to heal the divide. He says he will bring the country together but was unable to do anything towards unity in his little church? What leadership did he show there? Where were all his big ideas of change when he was in Congress? He wasn't a leader or a visionary there. Suddenly when running for the Presidency it all changes.

Why the racism Mr. Davis. Let's unite this country and not segregate our churches to black or white churches.

We should not be celebrating diversity, but be celebrating those things which unite us. We all know we are all different from one another no matter what we look like or profess.

Makes one wonder who Oboma would put on his cabinet.

can't go to that unpatriotic church for 20+ years and then deny its teachings when they get in the way of your campaign.

"True to the (your) faith . . ."

If you, Obama, are trying to say you don't believe in Rev. Wright's sermons, why didn't you just transfer to another Historically Black church long ago? Nothing held you to that particular congregation.

Mixing church and state has an very interesting history.
Black Liberation Theology was started a long, long time ago.
Reverend Wright's mentor in Chicago was a William DuBois.
DuBois' mentor was one Karl Marx.
DuBois received the Lenin Peace Prize in Moscow.
One can verify this on the Internet.

Romney gets ousted from the race because of his LDS beliefs that some claimed are anti black. Shouldn't Obama be ousted for his beliefs that some claim are anti white?

Of course there is freedom to worship God as one pleases, however, there is also freedom to choose what I support. I consider Rev.Wright's statements divisive and offensive and I choose to distance myself, in all meanings of the word, from him. He can continue to speak, it's his right, and I will continue to find congregations where the message is uplifting and unifying, which is my right. Tolerance is not acceptance of all values preached in a society. It is accepting those values that we accept to be true and being able to live with those who disagree with us without causing them harm or interfearing with their rights. Let Wright keep preaching, but as for me, I choose to not support him or any canidate who supports him.

McCain's odds look better and better. If these type of scandals keep coming out, he'll be a shoe-in.

Are words important? If so, they must have fixed meanings. If their definition is specific only to the speaker; might that suggest immediate loss of any pretended importance? Are words used by one speaker any different than those same words used by another?

If a white person says the “typical black person” acts in a particular fashion, are such words racist?
If a black person says the “typical white person” acts in a particular fashion, are such words racist?

If a white person uttered racial or ethnic stereotypical words, is that white person a racist?
If a black person uttered racial or ethnic stereotypical words, is that black person a racist?

Mr. Obama’s preacher repeatedly defined “typical white people”; clearly expressing his inner feelings about what they do and think. He categorically placed white America into a monolithic stereotype. Were such words employed by any white preacher (person) Reverend Wright would immediately call him out.

Mr. Obama does the same thing to his grandmother that his preacher does to white America.

Mr. Davis condones a different standard for “African American” churches and the words spoken therein.

The word Racist has specific meanings which appear to include the above examples.

The religion of black communities is and has always been a political force to be reckoned with. Reverand Martin Luther King was first and foremost a Reverand. And there is no doubt of Martin Luther King's ties to socialist ideologies. Rather than completely dismiss such ideas out of hand, perhaps you Utah Mormons could learn a thing or two about politcal as well as religious diversity. The "neocon" way is not necessarily the best way.

And considering the role of religion in the civil rights movement (the movement in which Martin Luther King was killed), I would think that the Mormon Church would have had their "revelation" giving the priesthood to blacks much sooner if they had considered an alternative to Republican/Conservative agendas!

First off, I wish people would stop assuming black and white are mutually exclusive. Barak Obama is probably more white than black in his background. He has chosen to go to a historically black church, so can we argue he is religiously black?

On the issue of separation of church and state. The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints was forced to accept this by the federal government. Even at that we do not advocate it. We fully claim the right to intervene in political issues that we see as moral issues.

I for one totally applaud Elder Jensen speaking out on the treatment of immigrants. I applaud President Hinckley's vocal denunciation of racism.

One last thing, I think it is a bit much to say that the low attendance at Rev. Davis speach is a mark of racism. How well publicized was it? I got the impression that this was part of a regular series, so how did attendance at his speach compare to other speachs in the same series? These are the questions that need to be asked to get the right answers.

I applaud any group that organizes itself to support individual politicians and advocate outright-political as well as mostly-moral positions.

But if their advocacy is not politically neutral, the donations they receive should not be tax-deductible as charitable contributions.

The main reason that Utah is so Republican is neither a result of Civil Rights issues or economic issues but the Democrats full steram ahead attack on traditional morals.

It is the complex of the same gender marriage lobby, anti-child rhetoric exemplified by the zero population movement and the pro-abortion lobby that have caused Utah to become so Republican.

The takeover of the Utah Democratic party, at least in the minds of many, by the Ross Anderson faction has really pushed people to vote Republican. I used to vote Democratic in state legislature elections when I lived in Utah just because I figured the Republicans had too much power.

However with Anderson's attempts to suppress freedom of religion, to advance disruptive, abuseive protestors at the cost of religios faith, to put a bar on every coner with half of them being topless and to keep bars open 24 hours I distrust the Democrats.

I do not always agree with Bush. However the vitriol of the anti-Bush campaign I can't stand. The Mayor's disrespect for his office in using it to openly protest the president is unbearable. I am glad he is gone but still distrust Democrats.

When a white utters racist remarks he is a bigot. When a black utters racist remarks he is not. And the Rev. Davis expects to be taken seriously. He was fortunate to have 40 listeners to bore.

This is what bothers me about SOME black politicians. I just don't know if I can "take them seriously" if the people they "hang with" (for 20+ years!) are such racists! What this pastor has said is way beyond any acceptable level of dialogue. The "chip on their shoulder" mentality of some minorities is frankly frightening to me. With the attitudes they have...what would they do if they held power??? Would there be reparations for slavery? Would there be more affirmative action? I've been a "victim" of that twice that I know of. BECAUSE OF his association with a man who says things like that I am hesitant to vote for him. I WANT to vote for him, I like his ideas, but this kind of stuff scares the be-jeebers out of me!

Some of my statements about what Mayor Ross Anderson had attempted were exagerations. Still, it often seemed like that was the net result he wanted.

He would flip-flop on his longheld refusal to let Nordstrom move when the church bought Crossroads and it became a way to hurt the church.

What outrages me the most is the democrats who ran in 2006 on the platform of impeaching Bush. THis is a case of total disrespect for the impeachment process. The process was meant to remove presidents who broke the law, not just remove people who have pursued policies you disagree with. I am tired of the hate filled vitriol of the democrats.

This is why I want Barak Obama to win the nomination. I may not agree with him much of the time, but at least he is consistent and does not bend the truth and lie. He also does not claim that his opponants are part of some vast conspiracy. He also made his money honestly, and not as a lawyer of a firm involved in defrauding the government or by insider trading in the futures market.

Challenging your country is not unpatriotic. Speaking out against the treatment of fellow african-americans is not racism, but defiance of wrong. I don't agree with everything Rev. Wright said, but I find the words of Brigham Young regarding race to be far more offensive than anything uttered by Rev. Wright. So how many of you are willing to disavow Brigham Young? And Rev. Wright wasn't claiming to be a prophet seer and revelator.

I wish we as a society were above all of this. It seems to me (granted I have not lived outside of Utah) that the majority of whites are willing to look past race but the blacks aren't ready to leave the race issue behind. Blacks continue to bring it up and stir it up. I wish everyone would follow what Dr. King stated, "Judge people not by the color of their skin but by the content of their character."

If Obama cannot disconnect with his preacher, then I wouldn't want him to be the President of the United States. That preacher is a fanatic and unAmerican and I just can't with all good concious vote for a man who listens and partakes of that kind of language that is said from that Wright.

Dont ever think that racism is gone in this country. People say blacks cry "foul" all the time, but I cant telll you how many times I play games online and hear white kids use the "N" word. That tells me that it's taught by parents friends or some type of influence. "White" Utah doesnt hear or see it, but trust me, it's out there!

Does it really matter? They are two pathological liars. How much do you want to bet that if Obama gets elected that within 6 months he will go from hiding his middle name to emphasizing it. Both of these people are scary. We can only hope that they continue to tear each other apart so that everyone can know who they really are.

No Mormon has ANY grounds for accusing anyone else of being racist!

Mormons had an official racist policy of excluding blacks from holding the priesthood for over a century!

Don't even start, you hypocrites!

The Black community by and large doesn't want to be assimilated and become "American" as other minorities have done in the past. We have black caucus, united negro college fund, NAACP, sharpton, Jackson and so many others who are more interested in preserving their power base which would disappear if blacks were truly integrated. Until the black people make an effort to work within the constitutional frame work they can never be integrated.

It is funny how any statements, no matter how untrue, anti-American and vile, made by a minority is ok. But ANY statement, even if true, made by a white person can be perceived as racist.

I couldn't agree more.
But the voters still can decide if he is known by the company he keeps.

Well said Reverend Davis, well said.

Too laguna......ohh the irony!

If Obama feels most comfortable in a Black Liberation church, fine for him. But its divisiveness is not good for being the president of all of the people.
On the other hand, Oprah felt uncomfortable with the hate speech, wanting to be a more encompassing person and left the church. Perhaps it would be good for Obama to learn a lesson from Oprah before considering running for President "of the People".

""African-American churches are, for African-Americans, the center of our community. It is where we can go for a sense of freedom and refuge," said Davis." If Mormons, even outside of Utah, were to say and carry out such a thing, there would be hell to pay, so to speak. Can you imagine what would happen if a stake center in say Seattle WA was to start holding political meetings for candidates? The IRS, the ACLU, and the "Separation of Church and State," folks would jump on that like flies on a dead deer. Due to a double standard and political correctness it is OK for Black Churches and those supporting liberal candidates. For example, Sen. Clinton has given political speeches in churches with no problem.

Rev. Davis says, "Black churches tackle another role, that of political activist."

I wonder how many of the people who are constantly harping about the SEPARATION OF CHURCH AND STATE will find this sentence objectionable. Had it been uttered by someone Catholic or, especially in Utah, Mormon, or practically anyone other than someone from a “Black” (how sad that such a term can still apply regarding an institution that, above all, ought not to be racist) church the responses would be fast and very furious.

Personally, I think the problem has nothing to do with racism, per se.

It is a problem with reasoned perspective (promoting the idea of the FBI developing the AIDS virus to exterminate Africans is ridiculously paranoid), patriotism and simple honesty.

It matters not what other reasonable and even laudable sermons and perspectives Rev. Wright may have. That he also harbors and loudly advances the highly objectionable, when not merely absurd ideas shown in those videos makes him someone to be justifiably ostracized. Even if he weren’t someone who is also, ostensibly, to be revered.

Truth:
honestly...white kids use the n word so they must be learning it from their parents at home...my kids learned it from that nasty music I tried to ban from their lives and was called a racist for doing so...A white kid living in america is absolutely saturated with such foul words from a popular culture that insists not only that they have a right to put that trash out there, but that anyone who does not embrace it is "unenlightened and ignorant"...at the same time said child gets to hear how every bad thing on the planet is his fault by virtue of white birth...especially if the child happens to be male! And Don...any past indiscretion by anyone may disqualify them from complaing about another person doing the same...but it does not make it less true or more acceptable!

Let me prove you wrong:

[(Mormon) churches are, for (Mormons), the center of our community. It is where we can go for a sense of freedom and refuge.]

It seems to me that this is the ideology already practiced by members of the LDS Faith, and I hardly find that offensive in the least bit and it would surprise me if the IRS or the ACLU would raise an eyebrow.

Let's not forget that the reason why we have churches that are considered "African American" is because we white people thought they were sub-human and not worthy of participating in our religious ceremonies. The LDS faith even went so far as to keep them from holding positions considered central to the gospel and achieving salvation.

And now we condemn them for keeping their African American tradition? There's nothing quite like pouring salt in an open wound I suppose.

Oh - and no where at Rev. Davis's church or the church Obama attends is there a policy that prohibits whites from attending services or being part of the congregation. These churches are not exclusively black, but black by tradition/heritage, and as a white person I see absolutely nothing wrong with that.

What a bunch of crybabies posting here. This is Utah, most of us know a handful of black people at most! Get over your unfounded anti-white discrimination "Let me tell ya'll what it's like, being male middle class and white..."
And let me tell you as a mom of 3 kids, popular culture isn't defining my children with their foul words. It's called making an effort and being a part of your kids lives, and don't be so worried about what other people think.

If in fact the LDS Church is lead thru Priesthood authority then who are you (or anyone else) to tell God to whom he may confer the Priesthood?

Biblically the Priesthood was very restricted in who could hold it, was that racist? Currently many religions do not confer their Priesthood on women; is that sexist and if you think it is you would have to condemn them as strongly as you seem to condemn Mormons. What if an African-American church does not ordain women, would that even the score for you?
If, on the other hand, the LDS church is not lead by Priesthood authority then you do a favor to whomever you decline to confer your fraudulent Priesthood upon. As it was, the President of the Church was prompted to confer the Priesthood upon Blacks as soon as conditions in society would tolerate it, just as it had always been said would happen. (In the 1840's even abolitionist had very restrictive views on Africans; do you really think the world would have accepted Black Apostles?)

The "Racist Mormon Church" is a common refrain in these boards, however it really doesn't hold water.

What about all of us "Mormons" who never experienced the so-called "racist" side of the church? As a member of the rising generation, I have seen nothing but love and acceptance come from the LDS Church. Like it or not, the "Mormons" have just as much right as the rest of the world to grow and to learn from the past, and I'm proud to say we've done just that. Why should our policies and practices have to remain static in a world of change? Why do you expect us to own and live by policies long done away with?

Stop embracing a tired, faulty rhetoric toward the LDS Church that could be so easily turned on organized religion in just about any form; go back far enough, and all religion is racist.

It is easy to claim to ignore race when race gives you every advantage you have ever had.

When you and some of your white budies enter a room and hear a black person say "I don't feel safe with all these white people around", when you see someone stand by their car and tremble as you walk by because they assume as a white person you are going to rob them, when you have someone tell you it is so wonderful that the Lord now allows white men to hold the priesthood, then you will understand.

Don't get me wrong, I am not saying anything about the priesthood ban per se. What I am saying is that some people have a very inpolitic way of speaking about it.

I have known too many people who were stopped by or followed by the police just because they were black. I even knew a guy who had a cousin who had the police break his tail light so they could give him a ticket. There are a lot of reasons there are problems, but do not claim there is no racism.

I have to respond to Stewart. The fact of the matter is that it is the church itself that has chosen to avoid politics. I do not think a change in Seattle or Detroit would produce an outcry.

Her in Michigan, we have Romanian Baptist Churchs, Macedonian Orthodox Churchs. You need to accept that African Americans are an ethnic group. Once you internalize this and stop accusing people who belong to a group based on race of being racist than you will have made progress. You might as well accuse Jews of being racist since only Jews are Jews.

Anyway, many wards in Utah are way more white than black churchs are black. I mean, with Obama being half white his congregation was more white than the average ward in Utah is black. So consider that before you denounce others. Maybe you hate the LDS Church too, I don't know, but I will not accept your definition of racism.

Here's the difference for you. A member of ANY race could sit down and feel comfortable at a Catholic, LDS, or other church. The "African-American" churches are FOR "African-American" because they are so "African-American" oriented that no other race feels welcome or comfortable there.

Sure Hillary has never been called the "N" word, but I'm sure she has been called the "C" word (funny how you never hear mention of the "C" word...it probably wouldn't even be censored) by I'd go as far to say Rev. Wright.

I've listened to Rev. Wrights sermons they are at most 5% religion, the rest is anti-american, anti-white, anti-bush, anti-republican/conservative rhetoric.

Saying his sermons are just "Challenging the country" is like saying KKK rallies are "Just challenging the black community".

Davis said "Ninety percent of what African-Americans are doing outside of their private homes are things related to or connected to their church."

Do you really want Obama in the presidency doing "Ninety percent" of what he learned while sitting in the pews of Rev. Wright's church?

The Reverend Davis does not seem to understand the American public's perception of Obama's releationship with his minister.

Now that it has become apparent that Obama attends a church where such strong racial doctrine is taught from the pulpit, we do not expect him to now seperate himself from the church. It is too late. It would appear that he were doing so only becuase he was caught.

But the Rev. Davis should be able to understand that to most Americans, they select and attend church where they believe in and tend to adhere to to doctrines that are taught. Rev. Davis should not expect the everyone to buy in to the sales job Obahma is trying to tell us, that he has attended this church for years, but does not agree with the teachings.

As Rev. Davis points out, especially in black congregations, it becomes your social life. How many of us associate socially with people who we have strong opposing views on important issues? We tend to migrate towards our own type.

We will never solve any discussion on religion here. We will never solve the issue of racism either. However, we can say that racism exists in whites, blacks, orientals, Hispanics, and any other race. It will never go away totally.

We have made great progress in the last 40 to 50 years and the important think is that we continue to make progress. For some the progress is too fast and for others too slow. But we are making progress.

Statement by Rev. Wright, or any other minister, whether white or black, will only continue to inflame the tensions already existing.

When an intelligent conversation about race or racial issues are stopped by someone yelling racism we will never work it out.

No one living today owned slaves. Those who were involved in the 50s and 60s with segregation are either close to dead or they are dead. As long as this those who bring up the past as reason to beat this country down then we will never get beyond racism.

As long as there are people pushing a black agenda or a white agenda then will will be mired in the muck.

So we have a white pres candidate that has a pastor that the candidate considers a mentor. Looks to him for advice for not only spirutally and politically. The pastor has been known to give anti American anti black sermons. I am sure the black community would look the other way and say that the candidate shouldn't disown the pastor. WHO ARE YOU KIDDING? THE BLACK COMMUNITY INCLUDING REV DAVIS WOULD BE RIOTING IN THE STREETS.

Thank you Rev. Davis for trying to help us understand a situation with which we have next to no experience. I hope we can all keep talking and listening to each other, until we come to the point we also understand one another.

I'd feel sheepish if I sucked up that much "thanks"
No experience with predjudice?
No experience with a unique religious community?

yea, yea and nay nay...talk straight....

reverse discrimination will never cure discrimination.