Once again, they want their cake and eat it too. Welcome to reality. Breaking away is not cheap, and either are high school sports.

Let me get this straight, if Charter Schools were dissolved and the students went back to their respective public schools then the costs would be less, or even more affordable? Hmmm, but then again, we would have less of a percentage of the total students playing sports which would be more equitable to all... Why can't the Public Schools pony up to help the situation to allow Charter Schools to play? This really shows the arrogance of Public Schools towards Charter Schools....

Charter School parents pay the same taxes which pay for the Public Schools sports programs. Since Charter Schools are a different form of Public Schools which use Public monies why the discrimination?

Charters are growing out of control. No one anticipated this. They need to be placed under the authority of local school boards or be shut down.

Charters may be growing out of control in some people's opinions but they definitely should not be under the control of the local School Boards. Why did they split off anyways? If you ask the founders of the Charter Schools you would find that they probably split because of the lack of response from the local School Boards.

I realize that it must have come as a shock to the Charter folks that sports cost money. Apparently they forgot that balls, bats, helmets, uniforms, playing fields, scoreboards, officials and all of those other aspects of a single game have to be paid for. Simple economics would explain that a smaller population would have to pay a higher price just because there are fewer people shouldering the burden. That is not unique to Charter Schools. In a school district my tax dollars may go to re-sod our arch enemys football or softball, perhaps the Charters should band together to reduce the cost. As for the districts "ponying up" I don't see any reason to provide sports welfare. You chose to be a charter school, there are costs for sports either pony up, or quit whining. Sports programs are not a right.

Don't see why the charter schools and their parents can't be out there doing what the rest of the booster clubs and parents do: Sell advertising space in the sports programs to local businesses, work in concession stands, buy the $75 shoes, ask for money from supporters, wash cars, sell - and buy - your school's t-shirts and hoodies. And if you still haven't raised enough money after all this, hope the school can find a little to make up the difference. There is never enough money to go around for high school sports.

And try to have fun while you are doing all these things. Remember, it is for the kids....

This isn't about politics, opinions, etc... It's about kids. Charter schools are public schools that fill a niche that was left out by the traditional public schools. That is the reason for their existence in the first place. If the kids want to play sports while getting a quality education why should they be penalized? That said: they would probably benefit far more by creating their own league. Unfortunately, Charter schools are so drastically underfunded that this would be next to impossible to achieve.

Why should public schools pay for charter shcools, doesn't make sense to me you choose to attend these schools you pay the fees!! Lets say I wanted to go hunting on your private ground would you let me do it for free, oh no thats worth some money to you and you pay property taxes every year so you are going to charge me. On the other hand I can hunt the public ground with no extra fees. I am not going to pay more taxes so you get another discount! Go pay your high tuition fees to these schools and get the same education you can get from a public shcool, its all about the work the kid puts into it not what the teacher teaches the kid!!

It's my opinion that the school districts are generally insulted by the very existence of charter schools. It wouldn't surprise me to find their ego causes them to act in power-hungry manner hurting the students not under their jurisdiction.

I strongly support charter schools.

Did the legislature not give charter schools an equal portion of the money? Are they not at funding parity?

IF they are, then they should stop whinning. IF they are not, let them whine.

As for deciding costs, that should be easy enough to do. Simply do an audit of the funds and you are done.

If they are receiving the same funding as the school district, then they should pay the amount necessary for the sports if they want to participate. It reminds me of a case of home schooling, which I have no problem with. A parent just decided to come into my classroom and borrow, without permission, some of our classroom books. Those books were bought by the school district by the tax payers to be used in our school in my classroom. If I hadn't caught that parent and stopped them, I wouldn't have had enough books for my classroom. It's the same way for Charter Schools, if they are not receiving the amount needed for children to participate in sports, they need to complain to the state legislature. Where is the money going that they are given for these activities from the state, if in fact they are given the same amount as the school district per child? Perhaps they are spending the money in other areas. These charter schools need to be audited, just like district schools, especially when it comes to the money needed for children to participate in sports. We need more information.

I think that Charter schools were set up to be an alternate to the public education system. It allowed parents another option for their children to receive a quality education. With education being the keyword, if they choose to field athletic teams they should have to pay the offset costs. If quality education is the goal then it is best served without athletics.

The solution is simple. Get rid of the dual public school system. Charters want to be separate entities, and then they want to be part of the mainstream system at the same time. In my opinion, you can't have your cake and eat it too. They are now getting property tax money from school districts. Why don't they take that money and build their own sports facilities and put together their own teams?

The Charter Schools do not receive the same funding as do public schools. They do receive the WPU and a bit extra but they have no taxing authority, therefore, they have no voted leeway, no bonds, etc...

Charter schools will be getting quite the funding increase this year. The "traditional" school districts now have to pony up a per dollar amount of the property tax revenue they receive and hand it over to charter schools. I just cannot describe how this makes me feel. They are the personal pet project of arch conservative republicans in our state legislature who just don't give a hoot about public schools. I vote for a bond increase to give my kids decent schools, and the legislature hands a large portion of that money over to the charter schools. Exciting place to live, isn't it.

Thanks to the 2008 Legislature, your Charter School will now receive a portion of the School District's property taxes. While Charter Schools will still have no taxing authority, they are receiving taxing authority benefits.

American Leadership Academy in Spanish Fork and Rockwell Charter High in Saratoga Springs have found a way to have competitive sports, maybe other Charter Schools should contact them to find out how to it all. ALA has been in competitive sports for at least two years and that without the extra tax money from the School District.

Bottom line if sports is sooooo important to the Charter School parents they need to either find a way to finance a team at their Charter School, have the Charter School pay the District's portion of the sports program or leave their child in the District School. You wanted choice, you made your choice now you have to live with the consequences of that choice.

It's stunning to read opinions thrown about by persons who have no understanding of the facts.

@Clare - parents who send their children to PUBLIC charter schools (the only kind in Utah) are also tax payers who fund textbooks. I'm astounded that you, as a teacher, could be ignorant of this.

@RE: Oh MY - Charter schools ARE PUBLIC SCHOOLS and they do not charge tuition.

@Raise the money, charters - Parents of charter school students who play sports in neighborhood schools DO raise funds with other parents as part of their child's participation with that team.

If any of you are interested in how schools REALLY work perhaps you might consider visiting one for a day.

I don't think we are that ignorant on charter schools. They get the WPU for students that attend, have a ceiling on the number of kids per classroom (makes public schools envious on that one), require parent participation, don't have to worry about transportation costs, probably have more flexibility than a public school, and are constantly seeking to get a greater portion of the public education $$.

And the school - and the parents and kids - should be able to raise extra money to play sports with the public schools.

Those prices are outrageous and discriminatory. With the amount of lawyers who send their children to Charter schools, expect litigation as these fees are 'in addition' to the regular fees associated with the sport. I paid $25 for Track fifteen years ago. I'd have to pay whatever the current fee AND $75 if I was home schooled or at a Charter.

I my opinion many of the comments are totally of point. The article is talking about students who attend a charter school and want to go back to their "home" school to participate in athletics; not about charters starting up their own teams or leagues.

These are students for whom the school has lost the funding. The district or school can't be expected to subsidize these returning students who are coming back only to participate in athletics. Therefore, the student or the school sending the student back must pay the cost of the participation

Seriously. Dissolve all districts in the state and have non-paid elected school boards at each public school. It would make more sense than the way we do it now because parents would have greater voice in their schools.

James,

Charters aren't equally funded with District schools, mostly due to property tax and some federal funds that they can't tap into.

Article,

There are few Charters in this state catering to High School aged students that would be effected by this. ALA in Spanish Fork has its own functional sports program, so students won't be going elsewhere for their athletics. Two other High School Charters are aligned with Districts so wouldn't have the additional fees anyway.

This is more of a future barrier than a present one. However there are many 9th grade students that have no High School Charter to move onto that will be going to a regular High School. This group is being violated most by this rule, and has a very strong claim of discrimination. We also have the Home-schooled population that this rule would be applied to. They to would be discriminated against. I really think whomever is making these rules up should think about possible litigation that could come as a result.

If anyone bothers to read the bill they would see that this covers more then just competitive sports. If the Charter School does not offer Marching Band, Debate, Drama, Drill Team, Cheerleading, or anything else that Utah High School Activities Association sponsors, the students will have the opportunity to participate in their home school or the school they withdrew from to attend the Charter School. The law does state that the Charter Schools must allow and pay for all students who want to participate without any discrimination. So, if the Charter School has a football player they will have to let the drama, band and debate students participate and pick up the District's costs.

The costs that the Charter Schools will be required to pay will be averaged either State-wide or using a sample of districts.

Of course the Charter School students will have to want to participate in one of the programs and have to make the team. These students would also have to meet all the eligibility requirements of the District School.

TO STEVEN JARVIS,

SB 36, only applies to Charter and Online students. SB 37 would have applied to Home School students, it failed.

Steven,

The Property Tax argument is a moot point, thanks to the Legislature your Charter School will receive a per student share of the Districts' property taxes.

Another attempt by our Republican Leadership to destroy public schools. Curtis and his ultra-conserative posse sold the Charter School idea based on the fact they would be cheaper and more innovative.

These schools have proven to be more expensive and less innovative than the public schools. After realizing the fact that Charter Schools were more expensive our House Leadership did a sneaky thing.

Curtis and his coward cohorts passed a law taking a certain percentage of money from the school Districts. The Districts have in turn had to raise their mill levys to pay this cost.

Greg Curtis says he will not raise taxes. He and the House Leadership did by placing this tax on the individual school Districts.

We need to dissolve the Charter Schools or have them paid for out of the General Fund. It is immoral to have the public schools pay for them.

We need to throw out all the ultra conservative Republicans this fall. Starting with Curtis and Hughes!!!

So some charters get to share our school facilities and possibly push out non charter students in sports and other activities without a cost? They get to "design" a "private"-like school and have a school many "neighborhood" families would love while using the same pot of money to do it and they're upset to pay for athletics? Did you choose the charter for athletics? Or did you choose it for the arts, math and science or a curriculum? Our family chooses the neighborhood high school school because we live in the boundary. We have not chosen a different school for some educational emphasis. I don't think some students should be allowed to pointedly drain resources more than others when they have chosen a much different path. It's about time your "neighborhood" school got a break and the students going there because they simply live in boundary get a break. Let's have some positive reinforcement for that choice!

Let us not forget that charters get additional funding from the state for the first three years in start up costs. Also, since charters don't take Federal Money, they don't provide some of the programs that traditional schools are required to provide. It seems that Charters want complete parity with regular schools, yet don't necessarily have to provide the same services. I think what we are finally seeing is that charter school advocates are finally realizing that education is an expensive business, especially if you provide the frills. What is equally ironic is that when the charter school phenomenon began, they said they could run a leaner and meaner institution. I guess that isn't the case anymore. They certainly don't want to be lean. My opinion is that they made their bed, now they need to be satisfied sleeping in it.

Anonymous | 1:55 p.m. July 18, 2008:

The Omnibus law 'replaced' a portion of State funds to Charter Schools by sharing property taxes with local Districts. However that has been projected as a cut of 40K of funding to the school than what many Charters (mostly the Utah County ones) previously received. It is still significantly less than what an equivalent District school does.

I teach in the Elementary grades where Charters are needed the most (teaching the fundamentals). But in High School I really can't see any benefits going to a Charter instead of a High School because of programs and offerings. However, my main contention why this bill is wrong is for the 'feeder' kids, ninth graders intending to go to traditional High School after finishing ninth grade are being discriminated against.

It is inherently unequal to have a student who will be attending the same High School as a second student from a different school pay an additional fee, because the first comes from a Charter and the second a District. This rule will not stand up in court if it even stands long enough for a lawsuit.

charter schools arent NOT public .... they dont HAVE to take every child .. in fact they can throw the student back to the real public school

this state has gone on way TOO long with entitlement as it's agenda ... the have's having to pay for the have-nots ...

times are a changing .. incumbents are being removed and challengers are being inserted ...

if you dont have it .. earn it .. otherwise close your hand and stop making those who earned have to pay for you to do it ... since it is a kinda welfare system .. i suggest the parents and kids have to provide service hours so it appears that they are 'earning' it .. not just getting a 'free' handout

sports at a school is not entitlement .. it is EXTRA activity and has nothing to do with the school subjects ... losing focus folks ....

school is school and sport is sports .. you play .. you pay ...

Charter schools are nothing more than communal home schools created and managed by housewives and others who have no credentials in education. The rest of the country doesn't have an abundance of charter schools in the suburbs like Utah does. They are a joke and will prove to have absolutely NOTHING over traditional public schools. If the religious zealots and "Waterford wanna-be's" who send their kids to these communal home schools want sports and other extra-curricular activities, create your own. No one wants you back in the traditional schools. Good-bye and good riddance. We're laughing at you suddenly wanting to be part of the system when it suits you. And we'll be laughing at you even more when your kids don't get into great universities like ours do.

Fact: Charters Schools are PUBLIC! Deal with it.

Fact: Not every child's needs can be met in the local schools, it is the parents responsibility to find a school that does. Charters meet some of those needs.

Fact: For every student that transfers to a charter school only 25 cents per dollar follows the student to the charter.
75 cents per dollar STAYS AT THE SCHOOL THEY LEFT!

I don't see the traditional districts complaining about that. Yep, that's $48 million statewide that should go towards teacher raises and smaller classes!

Fact: Charter parents pay the SAME TAXES as everyone else.

Fact: The recreation levy those taxpayers pay DOES NOT follow the student to the charter. zero!

WHY then should charter parents have to pay more for a field, arena, etc. than anyone else?
Do we really want to spend more money on more fields?

Let the KIDS play, don't let the educrats continue to penalize students while they sit in their fat cat offices and do NOTHING to improve education.

This could be a win for Utah students but the educrats would rather play politics.

Teacher,

You sound like a bitter person, maybe that's why 25,000 students have left traditional schools.

Aren't the charters full of the nerdy kids that don't play sports anyway?

If their parents were serious about them playing they wouldn't have put them in the charter school in the first place.

Why are charter students allowed to participate in public school sports in the first place?

I would be very upset to have my child displaced by some charter student carpet bagger that comes in and takes a spot on the team away from my child.

There is something wrong with this picture. Why didn't the self serving legislators fund their charter school mistake properly? They now want us to pay for their bad planing.

It will only end when the charter schools have all the funding and the public schools are left with nothing - I wonder if they will share?

All those charter schools that you all are panning are an attempt to right the wrongs of a very misled public school system. The public schools system is failing and fast. For all you who want to disband the charter schools, think again. If you don't want them there then what are you willing to do to make the public schools viable and academically sound? From what I see all you can do is to complain about those who have acted to take manners into their own hands. They may have problems but I would give them much more credit than you can ever earn in my opinion. Public schools are run by the extreme liberal universities with the boards completely shirking their responsibilities in all aspects, except kissing butt on the superintendents.

To Anonymous: I am not bitter at all; like I said, we're glad to have you gone. The reason 25,000 kids have gone to charters is the same reason Utah has thousands of polygamists; lack of intelligence and critical thinking skills runs rampant. The American public school system has helped to form the middle class, which is the first time in history that such a group exists. Thank the early Massachusetts settlers and those who saw the genius in their free public education system for the middle class lifestyle that so many of you enjoy. Without it, we can go back to a "have/have not" society.

I forgot to mention this little fact. In six years of attending school board meetings I've never once seen a state legislator or senator there either. So much for their real knowledge about Utah's public education.

Why don't you run for school board and figure out what really goes on? This state is full of "arm chair" parents whose favorite pass-time is to rip on school boards but who have never spent any time in a school board meeting. It seems that just because everyone has gone to school they think that makes them an expert on public education. Get of your duff and attend the school board meetings. I did. They are open and public. I found out that the back-yard fence gossip and newspaper ripping of public schools is mostly unjustified and uneducated rhetoric. We have too many in this state who love to spout off their mouths but don't want to give up their favorite TV shows to actually get involved.

Thanks for going to the charter schools. It has made our local school much nicer without so many complaints and helicopter parents. Teachers can actually teach instead of responding to your email, phone call, nasty letter, etc.

Please build more charter schools and keep weeding out the problems.

Picking and choosing the aspects of public education that suit a student or his/her parents is not acceptable. Either be a part of public school and the opportunities available there, or go to the charter school and enjoy those opportunities. Personally, I don't want any charter school students on my team; it would only cause discontent with the team.
I think that the prices are fair. Form a league of their own and let them foot the bill for all of the expenses and let's see how much that costs the charter school families.

This article is about sports and kids having the oppertunity to play high school sports! Its a choice to go to a charter school, and if that student wants to play sports then they should pay the fee and be on the team. That simple!